Latest News: Forums Racing Wayfarer PY

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  • #4299
    Swiebertje
    Participant

    I just noticed the Portsmouth Yardstick for the Wayfarer has gone up by two points, from 1099 to 1101.
    Does anyone know why our boats suddenly are much slower?

    An influx of inexperienced young sailors perhaps?

    #10011
    W844
    Member

    Hmmm.

    Looking at the RYA database, it shows the PY as 1101 but it doesn’t show by how much it has changed. Suggesting either a typo somewhere or the PY was not changed this year.

    #10012
    bigal
    Member

    I recall that it was changed a year plus ago from 1099 but at Shoreham the Hartleys race off 1080 (Merlins 982 and Phantoms 1020 )
    The reason is that much of our sailing is done in planing conditions and the Hartleys are so much faster than the older , more rockered Wayfarers .
    We still can’t save our time against the Merlins but their fleet has Olympic medallists and National champions in it and are fast enough to beat an ex-Hornet champ on the water sometimes !! We have good racing with most of the Phantoms , the RS200s and the modern Lasers tho’ .

    #10013
    Swiebertje
    Participant

    Yes, but with all the new boats and new young and keen racers I would expect the PY to go down, not up?
    The 1080 you mentioned, could that be just the standard adjustments for wind and waves as prescribed by the PY rules?

    #10014
    bigal
    Member

    No scientific basis to 1080 – it just provides good h/cap racing based on past results . Altho’ Shoreham submits annual returns we may well be the only sea club that does so – the rest are submitted by inland clubs i suspect where the fast planing features of the Hartley are of not so much use and where the relative lack of rocker make tacking a little slower and where the winds are lighter .

    At Bough Beech last year the Hartleys were somewhat out-classed by the older woodies – I watched as Mike Mac was passed by two on a light weather beat .

    #10241

    My understanding is that the calculation of the PY is based on the returns to the RYA from the clubs. It may be biased towards clubs where other classes have performed particulary well in PY fleets and Wayfarers have not performed too well. I agree that it does seem odd that the PY has gone up by a very small amount, but this should correct itself over time. 1080 would seem to be challenging!!!! How do you do in the results overall? It looks like that is about 1 minute in the hour additional handicap!!!
    In others experience, how do Wayfarers do in fleet handicap racing? How do Wayfarers perform against boats such as Fireballs, GP14s, RS200s and 400s and Lasers (a selfish question on my behalf!!!)

    Trevor
    Hofreki
    W10686

    #10242
    Colin Parkstone
    Participant

    It would be interesting to find out which clubs send in a report to the RYA, that may give a clue to the type of racing they get their numbers from.
    Maybe the results that are returned are not from clubs with new Mk4’s and so still represent the older boats in the class.
    The new younger and good sailors who have joined us of late may only do the open meetings and championship racing and may never do any handicap racing !
    We only have one race a year that involves a handicap and that’s a pursuit race. We sometimes do well in the very strong weather and sometimes in the very light with long downwind legs.
    A Wayfarer has never won as far as i remember but close twice in the above weather conditions, around 5th out of 45 starters.
    I would take the number while you can and also the silerware, it may not last as clubs always change the handicap locally if one class wins more than another!!!
    Oh how i like my class racing!!! The Winner wins on the day and not in the Time Keepers Hut !!
    Cp

    #10245

    I am very happy with official handicap. Having sold my Enterprise Kathy and I entered our Wayfarer into the Minima Yacht Club ‘long distance race’ (from Kingston Bridge to Hampton Court and back on the River Thames). It was breezy conditions with a long beat and spinnaker run, and we beat the Merlins, Solos and Enterprises on the water. We even beat the Thames A Raters on handicap.

    I printed out the PY handicap to take to the club as no one has raced a Wayfarer there before – and there was some disbelief expressed in the club house.

    So no complaints from me!

    Steve

    #10246
    Colin Parkstone
    Participant

    Did Kathy use her canoe paddles ??????? 😉

    #10247

    Well really Colin, didn’t need to, the boat flew, even the anglers couldn’t catch us with their maggots!
    Love Kathy

    #10257
    Liam
    Member

    We have been informed by a number cruncher in our club that our handicap should alter for a ‘local yardstick’ to 1071 because of our results. This is to feed the appetite of a few other classes. The irony is our results are no better than when we sailed our Woodies.
    A change by 30 points seems unnecessarily punitive.

    Apart from Shoreham, are there any other local yardsticks for the Wayfarer. I need to submit some evidence that it is not just the boat, the quality of the crew might have something to do with the good results. Atmosphere is not pleasant.

    If there are some other local yardsticks, what are they and is there any science to support them?

    #10260

    Hi Liam,

    Having to adjust your handicap by so much seems excessive and suggests:
    a) in your club the standard of Wayfarer racing is possibly quite high
    and
    b) the standard in other classes is possibly quite low.

    Is the suggested PY of 1071 taking all boats into consideration or is it just the leading few? It might be a fairer option, if it included every wayfarer that competed.
    How do the other sailors compete at national level? If you have a few boats that are doing well at regional and national levle and boats in other claees arent, it seems a tad unfair to disadvantage the wayfarer class, as they are making the effort to race beyond a local level and develop and improve.

    In our club, we have very few boats apart from Wayfarers – a couple of fireballs, an RS400 and a GP14. The Wayfarers always do well on handicap against them. I will find out what our ‘suggested’ PY should be……………..

    Trevor
    Hofreki
    W10686

    #10262
    Liam
    Member

    Hi Trevor.
    We are the only Wayfarer racing at the club which doesn’t help!
    Liam

    #10264
    Colin Parkstone
    Participant

    And your also very good in your Wayfarer so that will not help you either!!
    Would you say Liam that your competiton is any good, sounds like the old sour grapes thing you get from any club sailing handicap races.
    Your welcome here any time!!
    CP

    #10271
    Colin Parkstone
    Participant

    Sounds like Liam you may need a third party view on this, how about the ‘ Advisory Service ‘ at the RYA.

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