Latest News: Forums Technical Self bailers – number, type and position

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  • #4408

    Hello all you many infinitely more knowledgeable Wayfarer sailors. I wonder if anyone could pass some advise my way regarding the fitting of a bailer(s).
    I have just bought a rather nice 1993 MK2 Moores boat which has never had any bailer fitted. Instead it is (now was) fitted with the worlds ugliest bilge pump that wouldn’t look out of place on a cruise liner. It came off within minutes of getting the boat home. So now I need some advice on fitting bailer(s). The boat is for family sailing/cruising/bit of friendly club racing only. Do I need two bailers or might one be enough? If fitting one or two, where would be the best location in either case? What type of bailer would you reccomend?
    All advice greatly appreciated.
    Dave.

    #10701
    Colin Parkstone
    Participant

    A good first thing to do on any subject on this forum is to type in the ” Search Box ” top right of your screen, the subject your looking for an answer too. Your get lots back on self bailers to help you start. Come back after that and I am sure your get more help with anything you do not understand.
    Good Luck, CP

    #10702

    @Colin Parkstone wrote:

    A good first thing to do on any subject on this forum is to type in the ” Search Box ” top right of your screen, the subject your looking for an answer too. Your get lots back on self bailers to help you start. Come back after that and I am sure your get more help with anything you do not understand.
    Good Luck, CP

    Yes I did that but failed to find anything on the merits of one or two bailers and the relevant positioning of same. I’ll try again.

    #10703

    The usual arrangement is a bailer either side of the centreboard casing, at the lowest point in the boat. I think the medium size one produced in stainless by Elvstrom/Andersen is the accepted choice.
    To fit bailers in this position you will need to make a cutout in each floorboard so that you can get access to them.

    Of course, there is an argument for not making two big holes in the bottom of a perfectly sound and watertight hull. If you are singlehanding in ‘fun’ conditions you will need bailers, but otherwise a pump can be very effective, assuming you have somebody aboard to work it.

    #10704

    @No Disgrace wrote:

    The usual arrangement is a bailer either side of the centreboard casing, at the lowest point in the boat. I think the medium size one produced in stainless by Elvstrom/Andersen is the accepted choice.
    To fit bailers in this position you will need to make a cutout in each floorboard so that you can get access to them.

    Of course, there is an argument for not making two big holes in the bottom of a perfectly sound and watertight hull. If you are singlehanding in ‘fun’ conditions you will need bailers, but otherwise a pump can be very effective, assuming you have somebody aboard to work it.

    Thanks ‘no disgrace’. I’ve used those Anderson ones on other boats with great reliability. I see that, with the boat sailing fairly level and therefore the bailers working effectively, water on either side of the hull can easily find its way to the other side particularly around the front of the board case. Therefore, is the fitting of two separate (and expensive) bailers just a way of ensuring one is on the side you are when you come to open or close it or will it take too long to bail after righting with only one?

    #10705

    I think it’s quite common to fit a single bailer, but as you suggest it could be tricky to get access to it from the ‘wrong’ side. Mind you, you can’t normaly reach the bailers without bringing the boat level anyway. I usually wait till going through a tack before opening or closing them.
    I have to admit on my (previous) twin-bailer boat I never actually got swamped and so have never tested whether a single bailer would be up to the job or not. These days I sail a World which has two big transom drains plus two larger bailers so there are no problems in that department!

    #10707
    Swiebertje
    Participant

    Please note that while sailing the centre board is there to minimise leeway. The CB works by creating a low pressure area to the luff of the CB and a high pressure area to the lee of the CB. Because of this the self bailer to the luff will become more efficient with speed whereas bailer to the lee stops functioning all together. If you fit only one bailer it functions only on a tack where it sits to the luff of the CB. If you want your self bailers to work on either tack you have to fit two.

    BTW the standard bailer for our class is the Elvstrom/Andersen Supermax. While racing smaller ones are allowed larger ones are not.

    #10708

    Thanks fellow sailers for the helpful replies. Looks like it will be two Elvstrom bailers then for efficient bailing on both tacks. Time to dust off the wallet yet again (maybe should have kept that bilge pump afterall)!

    #10709
    Colin Parkstone
    Participant

    You will not regret having them Dave, and dont get the plastic one’s instead either as they just do not last!!!

    #10710

    @Swiebertje wrote:

    Please note that while sailing the centre board is there to minimise leeway. The CB works by creating a low pressure area to the luff of the CB and a high pressure area to the lee of the CB. Because of this the self bailer to the luff will become more efficient with speed whereas bailer to the lee stops functioning all together. If you fit only one bailer it functions only on a tack where it sits to the luff of the CB. If you want your self bailers to work on either tack you have to fit two.

    BTW the standard bailer for our class is the Elvstrom Supermax. While racing smaller ones are allowed larger ones are not.

    Learn something new every day. I never thought about the pressure around the centreboard and how it affected the bailers.
    On the World, the bailers are outboard, making them more effective when heeled, but presumably they lose the benefit of centreboard suction. Perhaps this is why a alrger size of bailer is allowed in these boats?

    #10711
    Swiebertje
    Participant

    The Wayfarer-world is subject to the same class rules as are all the other types. For racing its self-bailers must also be equal to or smaller than the Andersen/Elvsrom Supermax. You may have guessed it altready, the Supermax is also the standard self-bailer for the Wayfarer-world.

    Obviously you want the self-bailers at the deepest point. The reason is the same as why the drain of a bath tub is at the deepest point. Unfortunately that is also where the CB sits. Though it is not the deepest point, I always put self-bailers approx. two inches away from the CB case (sideways). This makes the nuts a bit easier to access with my big fingers and it makes the bailer easier to operate through the hole in the floor boards. And when they are a little away from the CB-case they don’t compromise the strength of the hog and CB-case construction.

    #10712

    @Swiebertje wrote:

    The Wayfarer-world is subject to the same class rules as are all the other types. For racing its self-bailers must also be equal to or smaller than the Andersen/Elvsrom Supermax. You may have guessed it altready, the Supermax is also the standard self-bailer for the Wayfarer-world.

    Ah I see, in that case, my old boat had smaller bailers (but the same size as I’ve seen in other Wayfarers); my World has larger Super-Chute ones. Which are not really as good, but the larger size does make them more effective.

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