Latest News: Forums Racing Gold/Silver/Bronze?

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  • #3946

    Not sure if the venue at the weekend influenced the discussion (WPNSA over our shoulder) but the subject of fleet size for the open events came up over dinner [which was excellent, as was all the catering put on by Castle Cove at the weekend].

    Apparently there has been discussion in the past about having a ranking system which creates gold, silver and bronze fleets (maybe there WAS a ranking system, but we have not been on the circuit long enough to know about it) – so that each boat is able to compete not only for position in the overall fleet, but also fight it out within different bits of the fleet.

    I realize there would be organizational issues, as someone {is there software to do it?} has to do the working out? but would this encourage more people out to the open events?

    Colin Parkstone

    If people would get more out of the racing with Gold, Silver, and Bronze fleets,lets go for it!!
    We had a ranking system in the past which could be used again to start it off.
    What is needed is for people to tell the class on here that they would like it to happen and why it would work for them ?

    C P 🙂


    I sail a Flying Fifteen where there is a very clearly defined and popular “Open / Silver / Classic” fleet system based on boat age / design. This works for that class because there has been clear development of the hull performance over the years, so each fleet basically sails off a different PY number for a handicap trophy, as a separate set of results to the main “open” fleet prize.

    The problem with this approach is that you can’t really rank W’s by age, as a well sorted MK1 woodie can actually be faster than a later boat.

    So is there any way of clearly ranking the performance of different marks of boat?

    If not, then the only way to split the boats up is on the ability of the crews, which is an entirely different thing. Perhaps you could have a “novice” class comprising crews who have not entered any major or open events prior to the current season (or perhaps longer), an “Intermediates” class where the crew has yet to achieve an agreed performance ranking (eg top 20% of nationals, top 5 in an open meeting etc), and a “masters” class for those that have?

    Would that work? Clearly the criteria for each class would need to be carefully juggled to get the required numbers for each.

    Colin Parkstone

    Anyone know how the lark class does it ?
    Think they have been doing it for some time so could have it off pat !!!
    C P 🙂


    The Dart cat class used to have, may still have, a ranking system that could calculate each boats theoretical place in a regatta and compare this with actual placing (all this in time for prize-giving). Thus everybody was competing to win the best performance prize, and against those who were ranked near them.



    @Colin Parkstone wrote:

    Anyone know how the lark class does it ?
    Think they have been doing it for some time so could have it off pat !!!
    C P 🙂

    Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 11:45 am Post subject:

    I asked the questioned of our Lark Fleet (thone of the best in the country) and these are the guidelines they use. – Ther are always a few people who fall outside of the rankings and thee are allocated manually normally by a team of 3 people who also talk to the person involved and others that may be affected. – the Belle Isle Travellers trophy is a circuit trophy but the rankings show up on all the open results and so each Open automatically shows your position in each fleet
    “All Belle Isle Travellers competitors should be aware that the intention of the Gold, Silver and Bronze fleets is to promote quality racing at all levels and spread recognition down the fleet. It should be noted that a Silver or Bronze fleet sailor is eligible for all main prizes at all events. The overall prize giving for all three fleets will be held at the annual Laying Up Supper.

    There are no set criteria for who is in the Gold, Silver or Bronze fleets. However, we are working to the following guidelines.

    At the end of each season the results of every competitor are calculated as a percentage of the number of entries for each individual open meeting. We then take an average percentage of each competitor’s best three events.

    Using this “best three” average we then divide the fleets as follows:

    0% to 33.999% – Gold Fleet
    34% to 66.999% – Silver Fleet
    67% to 100% – Bronze Fleet

    A degree of discretion is also required to ensure that there are no run-away winners in either the Silver or Bronze fleets. The Lark Class Committee will attempt to ensure all new competitors are allocated to the correct fleet based on there known sailing history.

    For example, should a National Champion or hot-shot from another class start sailing a Lark we would expect them to enter the Gold fleet. Should a sailor currently in the Bronze fleet regularly score results in the top third of the fleet we may respectfully ask them be promoted to the Silver or Gold fleets.

    In simple terms, to be in the Gold fleet aim to be in the top 33% at each open meeting you attend, for the Silver fleet you will need to be in the top 66%. Each fleet will be published before the start of each new sailing season (generally the Lark Winter Championships).”
    (the idiot in the front of the boat)

    Posted in the right place by Steve (on behalf of Margaret)!


    No problem – I have all results on Sailwave (or rather I will have, once I get round to pasting all this years results in) and can easily work out Gold, Silver Bronze categories. I considered doing this for the National Circuit series, but we didn’t have enough qualifiers to justify.

    I could have this in place for the National Champs at Falmouth.

    This must be a record – Colin and I in full agreement after only one exhange of forum postings!


    Colin Parkstone

    Come on you lot,how is the class going to know what you want if you sit at home and say nothing ???
    One week on and only a couple of replies!!

    🙄 🙁


    As a relative newcomer to Wayfarers, and having seen the quality of some of the racing crews and boats, I would feel less intimidated in class racing if I felt that I was racing in like company.

    I am currently the only Wayfarer racing in my club’s general handicap event, and whilst I continue to improve the boat (16:1 kicker, proper outhaul, inboard jib sheetng), still struggle to make much impression on the tea-tray brigade, although we have been giving some of the older Lasers and Solos a run for their money with the right course.

    I would love to take part in some of the open meetings, in a similarly matched group of sailors, as I feel this would provide huge learning opportunities.


    Colin Parkstone

    So why not come along Darren and if you think that the G/S/B fleets will help,do let us know.
    You are so right about the opens improving your sailing and the people in the fleet,when time permits give so much advice to help.

    Do come along!!

    C P 🙂


    I have just looked at the calendar and see that the next two events happen at times when I have other commitments, but Fisher’s Green is on my doorstep and has a close affililation with my club, so that looks doable as does the Upper Thames event.

    May just have to poke my toe in the water!

    Please keep up the efforts to implore more people to continue with racing these great boats.

    Kind regards,


    Colin Parkstone


    Your get a warm welcome from the fleet at our opens and if you go to Upper Thames I hope your up for some good after sail as they are renowned for it at that club.

    C P 😉



    I was sold on the idea of the open meetings anyway – good hospitality is just a bonus!

    Even if for any reason I cannot race, I will be in attendance to watch and learn (and maybe enjoy a pint or two).

    Kind regards,


    Please note the amendment to the NoR and Sailing Instructions on the main website, to confirm that Gold, Silver and Bronze fleet trophies will be awarded at the 2009 National Championships.

    See you there!



    10188 available to borrow for Nationals .

    Fourth Europeans 2008 when sailed by two pensioners !!!

    Need to be able to tow from Sussex to Falmouth and back .

    Preference given to overseas visitors !

    E-mail me ( Alan ) at

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